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In the corporate world, laptops and desktops are typically retired after three years. I have experienced this at large and mid-size companies. Corporations often lease the equipment, as it makes the bean-counting (and financial manipulation?) easier. That is one reason you can find hard-used, 3-year-old Dell and HP machines in quantity on eBay. (And, no, I would not recommend investing in these machines.)
That reality distortion field doesn't match the facts (and you'd better read our posting principles regarding facts...).
The analogy to car depreciation may not be numerically accurate, but leasing is mainstream for business computing equipment.
 


Ok, but wait: you bought a high end spec machine for light use? ...
Like Ric, I do Macs for a living, so I often do the same. A high-end Mac can still be productive when it's on its last supported macOS version. A high-end Mac can often be configured with a faster drive than a low-end one. The drive speed contributes more to my productivity than the extra processor power.

Because I'm semi-retired, my last new Mac was an Early-2013 MacBook Pro. My cheese grater Mac Pro, iMac, and MacBook Air were all someone else's castaways.
 


In the corporate world, laptops and desktops are typically retired after three years. I have experienced this at large and mid-size companies. Corporations often lease the equipment, as it makes the bean-counting (and financial manipulation?) easier. That is one reason you can find hard-used, 3-year-old Dell and HP machines in quantity on eBay. (And, no, I would not recommend investing in these machines.) The analogy to car depreciation may not be numerically accurate, but leasing is mainstream for business computing equipment.
I agree with Jim. However, using the word "investing" in this context is, of course, a self-delusion. Computers, like virtually all cars (the ones that businesses would lease, anyway) do nothing but lose value over time. (Well, that 20th Anniversary Mac may have some value but certainly not as a productive computer. Maybe I shouldn't have donated my old Lisa?) My 2014 15" MacBook Pro was a gift (water-damaged and abandoned by its original owner); I sent it off to MyGreenMacRepair.com and, $600 later, I had (and still have) an awesome machine.
 


Ric Ford

MacInTouch
Here's some hard data on prices and depreciation:

modeloriginal price 1.current retailmax trade-in 2.cost/yr. 1. 2.
2013 MacBook Pro$2599$1149$350$375
2015 MacBook Pro$1999$1349$590$352
2015 MacBook Pro$2348$1247$590$440
2017 MacBook Pro$2748$1799$1050$849
2017 MacBook Pro$3978$2499$1580$1199
2018 MacBook Pro$1799$1099$10303.
$ n/a​
2018 MacBook Pro$24593.$1925$1260$1379
2018 MacBook Pro$2699$1925$10904.$1609

1. not including tax and shipping
2. flawless condition with everything included and perfect; shipping not included
3. new Apple refurb
4. trade-in value at Apple
 
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Just a thought and questions to ponder... Throttling is a reality in the world of constraints and physics, so how much real life gains are to be palpated and achieved when ordering higher-rated CPUs, and is it really cost-effective in custom builds? I do love this MacBook 16-inch. I just wish they would bring the keyboard back to the 13-inch (please, Apple ;)
 


Here's some hard data on prices and depreciation:

modeloriginal price1.current retailmax trade-in2.cost/yr. 1.2.
2013 MacBook Pro$2599$1149$350$375

1. not including tax and shipping
2. flawless condition with everything included and perfect; shipping not included
3. new Apple refurb
One note on the 2013 model: it passed into Apple's "vintage" status in July of this year, so getting replacement parts may be an issue (and impossible at Apple retail stores).

In California, and in some countries around the world, Apple is legally obligated to provide parts and service for longer than five years, but not elsewhere in the US.
 


Here's Apple's trade-in offer for a 2018 MacBook Pro 13" (in perfect condition) with 2.7GHz quad-core i7, 1TB SSD and 16GB RAM: $1090... which is about $1609 for a single year of light use on Apple's plan... (I wish I could make profits like that).
Out of curiosity I just went to see what kind of trade-in I would get for the 2019 15" MacBook Pro that I bought a few months back. According to the Dutch online Apple Store it is "good for recycling". I am sincerely hoping that that is because they haven't added this recent model to their trade-in price list, rather than an accurate estimate based on information that they have….

Anyway, I don't regret buying that MacBook. I'd rather have the last iteration of a design than the first one of a new design, and I couldn't have waited another year for Round 2. I also don't mind the butterfly keyboard. I actually like it better than the keyboard on my 2012 MacBook Pro 15".
 


Ric Ford

MacInTouch
Some useful notes, perhaps:
Reddit said:
A comparison: Macbook Pro 16" vs Dell XPS 15
... To conclude, the XPS 15 is a great machine with port selections the MacBook Pro users wish they had. But if you're looking to have the best of everything, and are willing to pay $300 (CAD) more (plus $50 for the hub), then you'll be rewarded with 3 hours of longer battery life, a better calibrated and consistent display, the best track-pad/speakers/mic/build, better GPU, and a faster SSD.
Reddit said:
A comparison: Macbook Pro 16" vs Lenovo ThinkPad X1 Extreme Gen 2
... At $2421, Lenovo has done an amazing job in making a great machine with port selection and upgrade-ability Mac users wish they had. However, if you're looking for better performance/the best overall product, and don't mind spending an extra $600 CAD/$450 USD (plus $50 for the port hub), then you'll be rewarded with 4-5 hours of longer battery life, one of the best displays in a laptop, the best track-pad/speakers/mic, better GPU, and a faster SSD. And of course MacOS, if that's for you.
Brooke Crothers said:
MacBook Pro 16 Vs Dell XPS 15 7590: LCD Vs OLED — First-Look Review
After some hands-on time with the spanking-new MacBook Pro 16, it’s ripe for a side-by-side with Dell’s badass XPS 15.

This is a brief first-look which focuses on changes to the new MacBook Pro such as the display and keyboard.

To set the stage, let’s start with the Dell XPS 15 7590 OLED, which I have in-house. Note that there’s a pretty big price gap between the XPS and MacBook Pro 16– in Dell’s favor....
 


I missed this on my first glance!
Dimensions are 0.64 x 14.09 x 9.68 inches—up marginally across the board from its predecessor's 0.61 by 13.75 by 9.48 inches. It weighs 4.3 pounds, compared to 4.02 for the prior model.
The more telling comparison is back to the 2015 MacBook Pro 15". Those physical dimensions are: 0.71 x 14.3 x 9.73 inches and 4.49 lbs. So it is down 0.1, 0.21, and 0.05 inches respectively, and 0.19 lbs from 2015's metrics. It got bigger, but it still didn't grow back to 2015 levels. It is still an effort to put "more" into a smaller volume (less case traded for more battery).

Some folks were thinking of a return to the size and outer edge area (for big ports) of the 17". It is not that at all. It is a relatively lighter weight 15" vs that earlier era. There are more pixels, but they are smaller, which should help with image work (photography/video) but not as much with a desire for bigger pixels. The "retina" scaling may work a bit better as it can get to a 1.6 ratio (native:scaled). The 2015-2019 ratio was 1.5... now closer to 2x.

It isn't that much physically bigger of a screen. (15.4" -> 16" is 0.6"), so it is not a big gain in effectively bigger pixels. Unscaled images can fit with more tool/palette space around them though.
 


... I still don't understand why, with my bootable USB full installer, I would need an internet connection.
It is a 2018 MacBook Pro with a T2 chip. The OS has to be signed and the signature checked as valid. The secure boot signature is stored in the T2 chip.

Apple T2 whitepaper:
... The evaluation of the chain of trust continues on the application processor, with the UEFI firmware evaluating the signature for boot.efi, which is the macOS bootloader. The Intel-resident macOS secure boot signatures are stored in the same Image4 format used for iOS and T2 chip secure boot, and the code that parses the Image4 files is the same hardened code from the current iOS secure boot implementation. Boot.efi in turn verifies the signature of a new file called immutablekernel....
Each version of macOS has a secure boot signature (including all the 'dot' updates). If your bootable USB installer macOS doesn't match up with what is already in the T2 storage, then the T2 has to 'dial home' to the mothership to get a trusted one.

Restoring a data-preserving backup will match what is in the T2 (except in the corner case where it is the T2 storage that has been damaged/replaced/reset). If you have a “completely off the internet" modern Mac, then you also need a backup even more than normal (not that back-up weren't prudent anyway – it is just more irresponsible to not do them in that context).

Setting the secure boot to the lowest levels may work (where you’re not checking macOS trustworthiness at all). But if the system is completely wiped, you’re in a catch-22, since you need to get to recovery and an instantiated macOS image to disable that.
 



And, by the way, I see that I configured the Dell on the small business site with Windows 10 Pro. If you are happy with the Home edition, you can shave another $50 from the price.
I don't think you get BitLocker with the home version of Windows 10. That would remove it from the running for me.
 


Hi, was wondering if anyone knows whether Mojave can run on the new 16-inch MacBook Pros. I heard some previous speculation that it might. Thanks!
 


Ric Ford

MacInTouch
They’ve now finished the job:
iFixit said:
MacBook Pro 16" 2019 Teardown
...
Let's lay out our feelings for this new MacBook Pro:
  • Though the fancy new-old scissor mechanisms may be more durable than fragile butterflies, the whole keyboard assembly is still riveted in place.

  • The revamped thermal system is a welcome improvement to the notoriously hot-and-throttled Pro lineup.

  • The 99.8 Wh battery flies just under the FAA radar, pumping out 16.2 Wh more capacity than the most recent 15” model. With such a slight increase in case size, this capacity increase is surprising.

  • Despite the thumping new speakers, the podcast-quality mic array, and that giant screen, we can't help but feel that Apple can do better—especially after seeing Microsoft perform some real engineering magic to make its latest laptops more repairable. Here's hoping that the 2020 Pro linup will really take our breath away.
 


I don't think you get BitLocker with the home version of Windows 10. That would remove it from the running for me.
BitLocker isn't in the Home edition. Microsoft does have "device encryption" — you need TPM v2 with Modern Standby, UEFI booting, and I think Windows cloud login – the last to put the recovery key into a safe part of OneDrive. Full BitLocker has other management and recovery methods.

BitLocker is more local and can leverage encryption being done by the underlying device (self-encrypted drive).

Microsoft doesn't make the Home edition defenseless, they just narrow the features and options. That narrowing may not work for hardcore business cases, but it is “Home” edition.
 


They’ve now finished the job:
More logic board mount pads for NAND vs mounting more sockets/slots – can now get to eight NAND chips (three pads empty in this teardown). And a similar trade-off of bigger battery versus pulling speakers or something else away from edges to make room for another slot/socket.

Apple is still at $400/TB for ≤ 2TB SSD and $300/TB at the > 2TB prices. They'd get lots of folks more happily drawn into AFPS if that were $300/TB across the board, let alone something closer to current market rates.

The configuration that has 8GB of GDDR6 VRAM and 64GB of RAM, maxed out GPU and CPU, let off the chain a bit may hit the wall about as badly as the old system did, even with the improved thermals.
 


I do miss the MagSafe but have been using these third party-ones and they work fine, though it is not flush with the computer:
Man, those reviews are brutal! – almost 20% 1-star, with so many reporting issues with the size/fit, fragility, unevenness of passthrough for data transfer and even one citing it as responsible for laptop circuit damage! Since I intend to order a 16" MacBook Pro within the next 3 weeks, I intended to order this, but those reviews make it a non-starter for me. Great idea, though.
 


BitLocker is more local and can leverage encryption being done by the underlying device (self-encrypted drive).
As of KB4516071 in September 24, 2019, BitLocker no longer trusts self-encrypting drives. The default has been changed to always use software encryption.

The reason is that one year ago researchers discovered that the self-encrypting drives may have encryption that is easily broken. For example, they found that the Crucial MX3000 sets a blank master password!
 


Man, those reviews are brutal! – almost 20% 1-star, with so many reporting issues with the size/fit, fragility, unevenness of passthrough for data transfer and even one citing it as responsible for laptop circuit damage!
What's more, Fakespot gives the reviews a "D" rating: only 30.6% of the reviews are reliable (all the negative ones?) and their engine "has profiled the reviewer patterns and has determined that there is high deception involved".
 


Ric Ford

MacInTouch


... I bought a "high end spec machine" ... (for) the value of productivity... I'm using a 2015 MacBook Pro to actually get work done efficiently, even though its hardware is slower.
Don't know if the same is occuring at your corner of the globe (sic), but down here in Oz [Australia] for some time now, I've been getting availability emails from Apple Refurb, informing me that Macs to die for (2015 MacBook Pros) are becoming available (probably Oz business off-lease material). They seem to have taken a year to grind through a full refurb process, with a 3-year warranty option available for the humble price (Refurbished 15.4-inch MacBook Pro 2.8GHz quad-core Intel i7 with Retina display – G0RG2X/A) of AU$3,689, when a 16” (2.3GHz 8-core processor) equivalent fronts up at A$4,400 (both 16GB RAM/1TB storage), which leaves me (not) wondering... why, for day to day stuff, I'm using a (last-Mac-standing a while back) white-plastic-fantastic MacBook, which is a light, smooth, rounded and comfortable, cool and very low power-drain dynamo, and which, with 8GB RAM and an SSD, is faster in Sierra than what I grew (slowly) to accept with newer Apple bits.
 


Here are some thermal/performance (and GPU) tests of the new 16-inch MacBook Pro vs. the previous model...
Hey, Ric, and others, an FYI. If anyone is interested - and following Ric's Amazon link, Amazon is offering the base model 2019 15" MacBook Pro with 16GB RAM and 256GB SSD for $1,999 - down from the list price of $2,399. That's a $400 savings!

I personally was going to purchase the new 16" MacBook Pro, but after seeing the price on Amazon's site - and following Ric's MacInTouch Amazon link of course! - I bit the bullet and purchased one. Can't beat that price.

[Here are specific Amazon links for MacBook Pros (plus two primary competitors from Dell for comparison). –Ric.]
 


Man, those reviews are brutal! – almost 20% 1-star, with so many reporting issues with the size/fit, fragility, unevenness of passthrough for data transfer and even one citing it as responsible for laptop circuit damage! Since I intend to order a 16" MacBook Pro within the next 3 weeks, I intended to order this, but those reviews make it a non-starter for me. Great idea, though.
What's more, Fakespot gives the reviews a "D" rating: only 30.6% of the reviews are reliable (all the positive ones?) and their engine "has profiled the reviewer patterns and has determined that there is high deception involved".
Griffin Technologies has a breakaway USB-C power cable [Amazon]. The comments on Amazon, however, claim that the magnet is weak, and it may not support the charging levels used by the larger MacBook Pros.

One nice thing about the change to USB-C charging is that you can use a port on either side of the computer. In my case, this eliminated the need to sharply bend the cable to reach the charging port.
 


Funny note: I've had four faculty members come to me about a way to get rid of their existing (butterfly) MacBook Pros and get the new one. Most have no issue on price.

I tend to let them know that they should factor in AppleCare+, since there is no more silicone mask between the keys and motherboard. And that it will be Catalina that's installed – not supported here (not yet). C'est la vie!
 


Man, those reviews are brutal! – almost 20% 1-star, with so many reporting issues with the size/fit, fragility, unevenness of passthrough for data transfer and even one citing it as responsible for laptop circuit damage! Since I intend to order a 16" MacBook Pro within the next 3 weeks, I intended to order this, but those reviews make it a non-starter for me. Great idea, though.
These days I am very leery of reviews. Have seen some competitors blast each other with bad reviews. Or one guy place several different bad reviews. On the other hand, some are obviously fake good reviews. So who knows. So far, I have not had any issues.

My kids and wife have been using this one for over a year:

No problems with it. But, they never remove the plug from the computer. It is pretty hard to remove.
 


Ric Ford

MacInTouch
They’ve now finished the job...
Well, actually, it turns out that there was "one more thing"...
iFixit said:
MacBook Pro 16" 2019 Teardown
  • Looks like Apple added a lid angle sensor. Why would they need that? Will this enable some cool new macOS feature?
  • Maybe. It could also be a clever way for Apple to trace the history of how the device was used if repairs are needed. For instance, if the display cables fray, Apple might want to know how much the display was adjusted, and how often.
  • MacRumors did some additional gumshoeing, and found out that Apple wants this little sensor calibrated after repairs. What do you suppose it's for?
 



Ric Ford

MacInTouch
Ooopsie!
fcp.co said:
Clicking Audio Issue with New 16 Inch MacBook Pro and Final Cut Pro X
... The new 16 inch MacBook Pro is a great machine. Bigger screen, new keyboard, faster GPUs and more. A good update that has addressed many issues and it seems to have gone down well so far. We even managed to get our machine to playback 8K ProRes Raw on an 8K HDR timeline. Pretty amazing. But when we came to edit our first look video, we found a problem. Nearly everytime we pressed the space bar for play or stop, we got an annoying loud click from the speakers. Take a look & listen! ...
#applequality
 


Ric Ford

MacInTouch
Here are some critical display and Thunderbolt controller details for the MacBook Pro 16-inch:
Apple Support said:
Use multiple displays with your MacBook Pro (16-inch, 2019)
... Your MacBook Pro has two busses for its four Thunderbolt 3 ports. Each pair of Thunderbolt 3 ports (on the left and right sides of your Mac) are different busses. Whenever possible, connect your displays to different busses to maximize performance. Don’t connect more than two displays to either bus. If you connect a 6K, 5K, or multi-cable 4K display, use a different bus for each of the displays.

#thunderbolt #6k #prodisplayhdr
 


Ric Ford

MacInTouch
I can't say I'm too impressed with Geekbench and its website, but, for what it's worth, I eventually managed to list benchmarks for the new 16-inch MacBook Pro, although I can't figure out how to sort or sub-select the list. Here are searches for 16-inch, 15-inch, and Core i9:

#benchmarks #geekbench
 


Ric Ford

MacInTouch
FYI:
Lifehacker said:
You Can Now Install Windows 10 on Your 16-Inch MacBook Pro
... if you recently tried to install Boot Camp on your recently purchased MacBook Pro, you were probably a little frustrated that you were unable to make it work. Your Mac, unfortunately, was too new, and drivers were not yet available to allow Boot Camp (and Windows 10) to run on it.

Apple has since addressed this problem and you should now be able to run Boot Camp Assistant without any issues. In fact, you don’t have to run a system update on your Mac or anything like that to get started. Just open up Boot Camp Assistant. That’s it.
 


Ric Ford

MacInTouch
Here's the full review from Dieter Bohn:
The Verge said:
Apple MacBook Pro 16-inch review: the one you’ve been waiting for
... There is an alternate universe where I might not have bothered to review the 16-inch MacBook Pro. In that universe, it would have been an iterative update with a slightly larger screen, nicer speakers, and new graphics card options. That alternate universe is the one where Apple didn’t go off on a thinness-at-all-costs Quixotic quest. In that universe, the keyboard always used scissor-switches.

But in this universe, here’s my review: it’s the MacBook Pro that lots of people have been holding out for. It rolls back the most experimental of Apple’s changes. The Touch Bar has an Esc key next to it, the processor is better cooled at the expense of thinness, and the keyboard is (almost surely) reliable.

It’s the no-drama MacBook Pro. And thank god for that because for people who want a big-screen, big-power Mac laptop, it’s also the only option around. This year, it’s a very good one.


Good Stuff
  • Keyboard
  • Improved thermals
  • Best speakers on a laptop
  • Improved battery life

Bad Stuff
  • Heavy
  • No SD card slot
  • macOS Catalina is still buggy
 


For whatever it's worth...

The battery in my Late 2013 MacBook Pro 13" Retina, nearing 6 years old and approaching 900 charging cycles, was showing its age. I'd been getting just about 2.5 hours on a charge. Because of the poor history of recent MacBook Pro models, I decided to attempt replacing its battery myself. (Although I was aware of rumors of the imminent - now real - 16" MacBook Pro, I'm not eager for a large screen model, and was wary of a new model, anyway.) I really like the 2013, with its 16GB RAM, 2.6-GHz, dual-core i5 and its fast 500GB SSD. I like all its ports: HDMI, two USB, two Thunderbolt, and card slot... and its MagSafe power connector. It's a sweet, compact, lightweight, fast machine with a great screen.

I felt I had little to lose. If the repair went badly, I'd have to buy a replacement machine anyway. If it went well, I could sit tight until Apple released a much better laptop.

Last week, a few days before the new MacBook Pro model was announced, I successfully replaced my battery, using a kit from iFixit and combining instructions from iFixit and OWC, plus some advice from YouTube. The cost was $109 ($99 for the battery plus $10 for the iFixit tools, which included everything necessary). (I'm merely an iFixit customer; no other interest.)

So I'm just reporting that the repair went smoothly and easily. – more easily than I'd anticipated. The hardest part of this repair was removing the glued-in old battery, which had to be done carefully, because damaging a lithium-ion battery can cause a fire. Although the kit came with adhesive remover, I didn't use it. It's highly flammable stuff, so I used dental floss (!) to slice through the old adhesive; it worked like a charm and required no solvent.

A week later, all is well and I'm getting much better battery life, though still not the original 8-9 hours.

Kudos to iFixit and its community of members who create the instructions and annotate them with clear pictures, valuable advice and details at every step. They gave me the courage to attempt this job.

Now, I'm thinking I can get another year or more from my reliable old dream laptop, while Apple works through the new MacBook Pro 16" bugs. Who knows? Considering Apple has reverted to the good old keyboard style... maybe even MagSafe will make a comeback by the time I need to buy one again. ;)
 


The hardest part of this repair was removing the glued-in old battery, which had to be done carefully, because damaging a lithium-ion battery can cause a fire. Although the kit came with adhesive remover, I didn't use it. It's highly flammable stuff, so I used dental floss (!) to slice through the old adhesive; it worked like a charm and required no solvent.
Another technique for removing glued-down batteries is to use playing cards and alcohol.

More specifically, use a card to protect the battery while using a metal pry tool to get started (if necessary). Then put some isopropyl alcohol on another card and slowly slide it underneath (using the alcohol to dissolve the glue) to separate the battery from the frame.

An Art of Repair video shows how to use this technique on a phone whose battery doesn't have any pull-tabs.

By the way, if you haven't already done so, leave a comment on the iFixit site telling them about your dental floss technique. It actually sounds very similar to the playing card technique (especially if you use a little bit of alcohol as solvent) and would probably work better for large batteries like those found in laptops.
 


... Last week, a few days before the new MacBook Pro model was announced, I successfully replaced my battery, using a kit from iFixit and combining instructions from iFixit and OWC, plus some advice from YouTube. The cost was $109 ($99 for the battery plus $10 for the iFixit tools, which included everything necessary). (I'm merely an iFixit customer; no other interest.) So I'm just reporting that the repair went smoothly and easily. – more easily than I'd anticipated. The hardest part of this repair was removing the glued-in old battery, which had to be done carefully, because damaging a lithium-ion battery can cause a fire. Although the kit came with adhesive remover, I didn't use it. It's highly flammable stuff, so I used dental floss (!) to slice through the old adhesive; it worked like a charm and required no solvent....
It would be interesting to see how exactly you used dental floss. I have a 2013 MacBook Pro 15", as well as my newly acquired 2019 MacBook Pro 15", and the battery life in the 2013 is abysmal. I've been thinking of doing the same as you but have always hesitated because of the supposed required use of the highly flammable solvent.
 


Last week, a few days before the new MacBook Pro model was announced, I successfully replaced my battery, using a kit from iFixit and combining instructions from iFixit and OWC, plus some advice from YouTube. The cost was $109 ($99 for the battery plus $10 for the iFixit tools, which included everything necessary). (I'm merely an iFixit customer; no other interest.)
I, too, recently replaced the battery in my late 2013 13" model using the iFixit kit and had the same gratifying results. I used the dental floss technique in conjunction with the solvent. Worked well without having to apply any prying leverage.

My town has a recycling drop-off that takes all sorts of batteries, so I was able to responsibly dispose of the old cells. I can now happily wait for the MacBook Air to get a keyboard upgrade before considering a new laptop.
 


Another technique for removing glued-down batteries is to use playing cards and alcohol. More specifically, use a card to protect the battery while using a metal pry tool to get started...
By the way, if you haven't already done so, leave a comment on the iFixit site ...
Thanks, David. I did, indeed, leave (several) comments on the iFixit site; I agree it's valuable to reinforce the excellent work of the pioneers!

I didn't "invent" the dental floss idea. It seems to actually have "evolved" from several other users who tried thread, thin twine, and, finally, floss. The floss, because of its high strength and very thin dimensions, works well.

It really doesn't need the solvent, though for people comfortable with it, that's certainly fine. It's just a little bit more elbow grease without the solvent.
 


It would be interesting to see how exactly you used dental floss...
I wish I had taken pictures or a movie, but I was working alone, and only had two hands ;)

I used about 18" of floss, wrapped around my fingers just as if I were going to use it on my teeth. I guided the floss carefully under one corner of each battery (one battery at a time), being careful not to catch any wires. Then, using a sawing motion, slow and steady, used the floss for its cutting/slicing action. It's not a "quick" action, but a deliberate one. Once the floss had sliced through about half the adhesive under the battery, I was able to lift each battery with my fingers, or (in some cases where it was still pretty stuck) I used a 1" flat-blade plastic paint scraper (inexpensive, wherever paint is sold) to gently separate the battery from the case by sliding the scraper underneath the battery. (Careful not to damage the battery. Li-ion batteries can quickly heat and even burst into flames. But that's why it's best to avoid any metal tools working around the old batteries. Honestly, as long as I was working patiently, I never felt that the operation was in any way "dangerous.")

Once the batteries were all completely out, I used the plastic scraper to peel away scraps of adhesive tape stuck to the case. Then, I used "Goo Gone" (a non-flammable adhesive remover) on a paper towel to loosen and clean remaining adhesive.

Again, not a "quick" operation, but it worked very well. If you're considering this, I highly recommend reviewing the very detailed instructions on iFixit, before you even decide to buy the kit. By the way, OWC also sells a kit for this operation, slightly less expensive, and has an excellent instructional video. I chose the iFixit kit because I liked their kit slightly better. I suspect the replacement batteries come from the same source.
 


It would be interesting to see how exactly you used dental floss. I have a 2013 MacBook Pro 15", as well as my newly acquired 2019 MacBook Pro 15", and the battery life in the 2013 is abysmal. I've been thinking of doing the same as you but have always hesitated because of the supposed required use of the highly flammable solvent.
There is a video on YouTube showing how it is done in the smaller 13" MacBook Pro. Am sure the technique is similar, as noted in other posts above.
 


Ric Ford

MacInTouch
Here's the best price I've ever seen for a new 2017 MacBook Air, one of my favorite computers, which can run both the latest and older macOS versions, uses a MagSafe power adapter, has long battery life, offers an SD Card slot and two standard USB 3 ports, and drives 4K external displays (via its Thunderbolt 2/DisplayPort connector) without trouble – generally just a great laptop, and you can upgrade the internal storage (although not its RAM).

I've advised several people to buy these with great success – priced for years at $830 or higher (with just 4GB) after refurb/educational discounts – then seen them used all the way through college and afterwards without any problems.
Amazon said:
The sale price is only good for today.

More info:
EveryMac.com said:
I’d buy one myself, except I already bought one from Apple, a refurb, that cost over $900 last year, which was really painful... :-(
Apple Store said:
Refurbished 13.3-inch MacBook Air 1.8GHz dual-core Intel Core i5
...
Subtotal: $849.00
Shipping: $8.00
Estimated Tax: $53.56
----------------------------------
Order Total: $910.56
 


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As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

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